Among our party that went on our hike last week, there was a gentleman from Out East that turned a year older in his early 70's on the trail. Besides being in great health (he had been going to the Grand Canyon for 5 decades, but thought that given muscle atrophy and balance issues this might be his last "Back Country" hike - but I doubt it), he had a small coterie of interests that he followed.
In chatting with him and his adventures (he is in the process of finishing up the Appalachian Trail), he comment that when he was in his early 60's he retired rather abruptly due to a work related issue. "Best decision I ever made" was his comment, and 10 years on looking at him there was nothing that I could hear or see to disagree with it.
As some shared readers may also know, FOTB (Friend Of This Blog) Old AFSarge from Chant De Dupart has also spent the better part of a year learning to be retired. It has been an interesting journey as a third party reading his thoughts, especially about the falling out of and falling into rhythms.
Why this sudden reflection on retirement? Going completely away for a week will do that to you. There is something about standing in the grandeur of God's creation, surrounded by wind and silence, that makes one think "Next week I have to be back arguing about language in documents for things that likely will never be read again".
It can be a compelling thought, if you think about it long enough.
In one way, I have "reached" the spot in my career that is probably the spot I always belonged in: the seasoned old guy who has seen almost every aspect of the industry, is the holder of some level of industry institutional knowledge, has no interest or illusions about moving up the corporate ladder, and in some ways is a sort of "Senior Stateman". It is not quite the same as the group of guys drinking coffee every morning at the local café dispensing wisdom and weather complaints, but it is as likely as I am to get to it in the employed world.
And yet...and yet, every day I have to finish here on the computer writing, put aside the sad looks of A the Cat and J the Rabbit, and get ready to go do battle again at tasks not of my choosing. An 8 hour chunk out of my day is pretty inconvenient at best.
Am I ready to retire? Financially probably not, although I am going to press into our Financial Folks a little more directly when we meet with them in December - not just the "Yeah, it is a thing I would like to do" but "How soon could it happen? What could I do now to make it happen sooner?"
I do not know that turning mid 70's on the trail is a specific goal of mine, but being in the condition to do it and having the time to get there is something that strikes me as more and more desirable.
I think as we get older, we start looking at the future differently. Time no longer stretches out before us in a seemingly infinite manner and we have to gauge what we want to do here on earth with our changed perception of time. I find myself looking at new ideas differently. In the past I might have been willing to tackle them, now, not so much.
ReplyDeleteLeigh, it is the same with me - in fact if anything, I am starting to build lists of "What I want to continue doing", "What I might like to pick up", and "What looks interesting but I have to not pursue it." It is a little disheartening in some aspects, but there is simply more than one can ever do or learn.
DeleteAgree with Leigh, the song Changes is rolling in my mind now.
ReplyDeleteAlthough my wife is well past 65, she works from home for the hospital. We don't NEED the funds but we saw how retirement and inflation and medical bills affected her parents.
Retirement is a modern theme of an era of good company retirement plans and such. My wife's parents retired from his Banking job and thought themselves all good for it. Generous people, they even paid for their kids to go on a few cruises and such.
But because they lived until 95 years of age inflation ate them up as they spent the last 20+ years of their lives in our walkout basement after selling their paid for home (the family home). We only "charged" them half the electricity bill as a sop to their pride.
To protect the public from Dad's driving (scary indeed) and to help with their bills (as wife took care they were paid and made sure their drug plans were the best available) I sold their car and became their driver to their 3 times weekly lunches and mystery rides we shared with them often. The saved money on insurance and such helped them quite a lot.
As I mentioned to AF Sarg, keeping your hand in some sort of employment is both a cure for "what do I DO NOW" syndrome and a buffer against the decades of fixed income Vs increasing costs.
I'm semi-retired but keep a few odd jobs and useful helper status with folks that need an extra hand for jobs.
Michael, retired now can mean something a bit different than retired two generations (to me) ago. TB The Elder, when he retired from his employment of 30 odd years, took a side job driving for a nursery which both kept him busy and allowed him to drive all over the state, which he enjoyed.
DeleteThe difference, I suspect, is in the optionality of the work versus the requirement. And there are plenty of ways to "work"; I sincerely hope Sarge is able to edit and publish his stories in a book format.
When I finished college 30+ years ago, I made up my mind to live to 100. Not that I actually expected to live that long. Rather, I didn’t want to be in my 70s, nearing average life expectancy, sitting around not tackling new and worthwhile things.
ReplyDeleteIf I “plan to live to 100”, when I reach 70 I’ll still have 30 years left to do stuff! That’s time for another whole career!
I recently retired in my early 50s, from my first 30-year career, with not nearly enough money to live off for 40+ years, so I’ll be making other arrangements soon, but at the moment I’m enjoying my “time off” (I’m busier than ever!), contemplating my next move.
ODG - That is an interesting twist on things. Given my family genes, 100 is maybe not quite out of the picture although males on both sides scarcely make it to 85.
DeleteI have thoughts about a second sort of career, more of hobby thing (full disclosure: Pursuing an advanced degree in Classical Studies which will change nothing but maybe give me some tutoring/teaching opportunities). And I certainly have plenty of other things to do as well to fill the time.
I will say The Ravishing Mrs. TB finds herself in a similar position as you - laid off at the end of last year - and is currently enjoying a Gap Year. And yes, she is busier than ever as well!
TB ever give thought about teaching english in Korea?
DeleteWith you interest in Asia and enjoyment of travel it seems a good fit.
Just a thought.
Michael, given Nighean Gheal's experience last year, I do not know how real that might be. She had a good experience with the students, but the program itself is overall like any government program and you are at the mercy of what the government wants. Also in my case I do not speak Korean at all, so that would make things even more difficult. And frankly, my age might militate against that (I believe all of her associates were also in their early post-college years). '
DeleteHonestly, I would probably fare better in Japan in such a role, as I do know some Japanese.
It also means I have to take good care of myself!
ReplyDeleteODG - Absolutely, yes. This has become more and more of a thought for me as well as I am going on. Especially given cost and availability, our health really is up to us to a great extent.
DeleteWith the way economic conditions are trending, pulling that retirement pin takes a wee bit more thought than ever TB. Pensions are usually lower than pay/SEI so costs need to be watched. Also the older the body gets the more prone to breakdowns/illnesses, something I saw first hand with both my parents. For a good many people finding a purpose after leaving the job can be a process that takes time. Leaving my job was not difficult, missed the co-workers more though and helping take of the parents in their last years was very fulfilling, a small repayment of their raising me.
ReplyDeleteNylon12 - Agreed, it takes a lot more thinking (thus, my list of questions for my financial guy keep growing). I have the "numbers" by bracket and while my best payout is my "assigned" retirement age of 67, that assumes a lot of things go right in my work, my health, and the economy in general.
DeletePurpose after retirement is a bit deal. I read at least one study that followed senior military officers and CEOs after they retired. If they did not have anything, they tended to die within their last six months.
Building social networks to replace or supplement old coworker networks is important - something that prompted the idea of staying here in New Home 2.0; I cannot imagine moving and re-performing that activity. And of course, good on you for being there for your parents - it is a model in the modern world.
I'm going to be turning 65 in a few months. Last year, out of the blue, I landed in the hospital wit a pulmonary embolism. Doctors and med students kept coming through and checking me out. I asked the nurse why. She said "Because, Mr. Forester, people who have what you have, to the extent that you do, are usually not breathing anymore." After leaving the hospital I went to see a hematologist. Her EXACT WORDS when she saw the CT results; "JESUS! This thing is HUGE!"
ReplyDeleteThat episode is behind me, no cause found, but what it did do was make me think of retirement. Indeed, those of us "at that age" can be taken out in short order in any number of ways. You can PLAN to live to 100, but as they say, "Man plans, God laughs." I decided to hang up my spurs this coming February. Do I have enough money? Who knows? Who EVER knows? Inflation? Lifespan? Unexpected expenses? Politics? They're all moving targets. How can ANYONE plan for THAT? All I can say is that I thought on it, prayed on it, talked to my wife about it, and sought counsel on it. Above all, it just "felt right." Everyone's journey is different, but I hope my experience helps you or someone else out there in the blogosphere...
Good heavens PF! So glad that things worked out as they did! I would miss you (as would others, I am sure).
DeleteYour precise experience is the one that haunts the back of my mind, along with my own family's experiences. TB The Elder had a serious run in with Staph pneumonia during my junior year of college. It certainly change his outlook on a number of things, including likely accelerating his retirement. And my mother, of course, spent the last 9 years of her life dealing with the issues of Alzheimer's. In their case, they had planned well and had years and years of good retirement - but they did not plan to end their days that way.
How awful to have planned for a retirement only to find out that you will not live long enough to enjoy it. None of knows of course; all we can do is plan as you have, pray, and do the best we can with the knowledge we do have. Here is to the coming February and a great retirement!
Retirement was something I never really put much thought into until it sort of fell into my lap. I got lucky with my last change in jobs which in a handful of years made it economically feasible and then there just came a point when we realized that it was my spouse's career or mine and that doing both wasn't a really good option. So we chose her career and I "retired" though I still struggle using that term for a number of reasons. I'm not disappointed with how it all turned out though it wasn't what I ever imagined.
ReplyDeleteEd, we are currently sort of at the same point. The Ravishing Mrs. TB is currently enjoying a "Gap Year" as her previous employment ended rather precipitously and given tax laws, it almost made now sense for us to have her work this year. I am curious where things will end up after this year, but given we now have the "privilege" of paying Federal, State, and Local taxes, I still wonder if it makes sense. I think my rule is that if we would pay more in taxes than is made in salary, it does not make sense.
DeleteThis is timely for me, TB, as I found out about two weeks ago I will be retiring Dec. 1st. I was already headed that direction, but my employer helped me along by eliminating my position, which triggered a severance package better than I really could have hoped for. (Bottom line, they wanted to get rid of me, and this is how they are doing it. With what they are paying me, I can live with that.) I tried to contain my elation as HR was presenting the package to me. While I am happy with how it is turning out, there is still angst about the uncertainty that awaits me. I have worked in some capacity since I was 16, and in a "career" type job for well over 40 years. Lots for me to process and think about, but I am moving on. And that is mostly a good thing. When I have time, I will come back and read all the comments offered here about the subject.
ReplyDeleteBob - I am both happy and sad that it is timely for you - happy as this is something you have been discussing for a while now as a possible outcome, sad that this is the way it happened (although I can easily picture you trying to contain your glee in the presentation). Given your history of a lot of work (looking at my history, I realized I have working at something for over 40 years now), I am sure it is a big change (but super glad the package is making it a smooth transition). I am sure you will adapt marvelously. Congratulations on an unexpected fork in the road with a mostly happy ending!
Delete